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PostPosted: Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:01 pm 
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Lately I have had the issue where I cannot access my whs shares, getting the attached message, that windows cannot access, I do not have the correct permission. This has happened in the past, the fix was to turn smb 1.0 on in Apps/Features. However, with that enabled I am still experiencing the problem. I'm pretty sure this is a Windows 10 client only problem. It typically happens to some of the shares but not all. Also, it seems that when it happens the shares I can access are read only, because attempting to save a file to them then results in the same access error. Of course, the problem can come and go, not sure reboot always resolves.

I am remembering now too that I use a Windows login name, i.e. my login is my email. This of course won't work in whs v1, so the workaround has always been to create my whs user account as name.gmail.com, removing the @. Then on the W10 client, I create an identical login with Credential Manager. Could this be causing issues? I wonder if a non-email login has the same issues? Anyone else experiencing this?


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2021 3:41 pm 
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Hi, on my clients (all are W10) email is used as login. To connect to WHS1 I use other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically ).
You have to remember to limit WHS1 user name to 15 characters, because of NetBIOS limitation.
2004 and 20H2 versions of Windows cause problems even smb1 is installed.

Cth.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 12:14 am 
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Cthulhu wrote:
Hi, on my clients (all are W10) email is used as login. To connect to WHS1 I use other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically ).
You have to remember to limit WHS1 user name to 15 characters, because of NetBIOS limitation.
2004 and 20H2 versions of Windows cause problems even smb1 is installed.

Cth.


Cth, thanks for this reply. Could you clarify further your comments:

- "other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically". Not sure I understand this. Please explain.
- "... user name to 15 characters because of NetBIOS limitation". Interesting, so my email is longer than 15 characters - it works, but as I have stated, sometimes it stops working. I will try a shorter login name. I had read somewhere that the issue was with the "@" character, but you are saying length is also issue.
- I am running either 2003 or 20H2 on my clients. Are you saying there are additional (new) problems here, or are the problems solved by keeping user name < 15 characters etc?

Thanks!


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 10:00 am 
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for me I have three clients
2=win 10 home x64
1=win 10 pro x64
As long as smb1 is installed I do nothing special.
I just install the whs connector.
Enable the guest account in whs1
Thats it.
I access the shares via windows explorer.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 12:07 pm 
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Ruben Rocha wrote:
for me I have three clients
2=win 10 home x64
1=win 10 pro x64
As long as smb1 is installed I do nothing special.
I just install the whs connector.
Enable the guest account in whs1
Thats it.
I access the shares via windows explorer.


Thanks Ruben. Is your login tied to a Microsoft account, that is, your login is your email address on the account? Or do you use a local, non email account? Also what versions of W10 are you on? All my clients are Win 10 pro 2004 or 20H2. Since I first used W10 some years ago now, once I started using the Microsoft account approach (email as logon), I had to create an additional logon in windows credentials. I don't remember where I read it but someone posted that whs v1 would not recognize the @ character in the logon name. So I would add a credential logon which was myname.gmail.com to replace myname@gmail.com. But post by Cth suggests 15 char maximum.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 12:24 pm 
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rbknox wrote:
Cthulhu wrote:
Hi, on my clients (all are W10) email is used as login. To connect to WHS1 I use other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically ).
You have to remember to limit WHS1 user name to 15 characters, because of NetBIOS limitation.
2004 and 20H2 versions of Windows cause problems even smb1 is installed.

Cth.


Cth, thanks for this reply. Could you clarify further your comments:

- "other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically". Not sure I understand this. Please explain.
- "... user name to 15 characters because of NetBIOS limitation". Interesting, so my email is longer than 15 characters - it works, but as I have stated, sometimes it stops working. I will try a shorter login name. I had read somewhere that the issue was with the "@" character, but you are saying length is also issue.
- I am running either 2003 or 20H2 on my clients. Are you saying there are additional (new) problems here, or are the problems solved by keeping user name < 15 characters etc?

Thanks!


Cth, I also looked up NetBIOS limitations. What I found is that computer name is limited to 15 characters. When I looked up user name restrictions I found for Windows 2003 it was 20 characters. Also, didn't see any @ restriction. Strange.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 01, 2021 1:51 pm 
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I keep mine updated all the time.
The current version for the pro client is
Edition Windows 10 Pro
Version 20H2
OS build 19042.804

And I use a microsoft account now but it is my name not a email which I also enabled a pin for a password
Prior to 02/2021 I was using a local account.
I had to reinstall the connector after.

As I said I have no issues with my mediasmart but I do with my Readynas.
seems like every major windows update breaks my connection to the ReadyNas

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 11:49 pm 
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Ruben Rocha wrote:
I keep mine updated all the time.
The current version for the pro client is
Edition Windows 10 Pro
Version 20H2
OS build 19042.804

And I use a microsoft account now but it is my name not a email which I also enabled a pin for a password
Prior to 02/2021 I was using a local account.
I had to reinstall the connector after.

As I said I have no issues with my mediasmart but I do with my Readynas.
seems like every major windows update breaks my connection to the ReadyNas


Since I rebooted my whs server I have not experienced the problem again. Still waiting. How do you use your name to log in? It seems now at least, for account mode of log in, Microsoft will only allow your email or a phone number. You can have aliases, as long as they are one of those two.

Interestingly I have an old ReadyNAS (2 disk) which I still use to backup some of my critical whs shares. It works so well, it has been years I think since i've done anything with it. Of course, it doesn't need to deal with the everchanging Windows 10.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2021 4:16 pm 
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Don't forget that for share access, WHS is particular about the date and time matching the clients.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2021 11:48 pm 
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lioninstreet wrote:
Don't forget that for share access, WHS is particular about the date and time matching the clients.


So I still have not had the access issue - it has been 2 or 3 weeks - will probably wait a little longer before drawing any conclusions. It seems others are not having the problem so unlikely it is some major W10 issue. The time matching is interesting - have run across this with Apple TV and iTunes library sharing, where lack of time sync can cause strange errors. To my knowledge though all my machines are set to time sync to time.windows.com and seem to be in sync.

My current theory is that it is an issue with the eSata/Sata controller for the external Sata connections (managed by Marvell 61xx). I have added a Mediasonic 4 bay enclosure and everything appeared to work great out of the box. The original ex470 61xx driver (1.2.0.46) works and as a bonus recognizes S.M.A.R.T. I had an updated driver (1.2.0.84) but I removed it because it doesn't pass the S.M.A.R.T. information. However, after several access issues described here and at least one hang, I upgraded to the later driver. I did that just about 3 weeks ago, and there has not been an access (or any other file integrity related issue) since. Although temping to experiment I think I will wait a while longer to see if the access issues comes back.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2021 10:42 am 
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rbknox wrote:
Cthulhu wrote:
Hi, on my clients (all are W10) email is used as login. To connect to WHS1 I use other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically ).
You have to remember to limit WHS1 user name to 15 characters, because of NetBIOS limitation.
2004 and 20H2 versions of Windows cause problems even smb1 is installed.

Cth.


Cth, thanks for this reply. Could you clarify further your comments:

- "other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically". Not sure I understand this. Please explain.
- "... user name to 15 characters because of NetBIOS limitation". Interesting, so my email is longer than 15 characters - it works, but as I have stated, sometimes it stops working. I will try a shorter login name. I had read somewhere that the issue was with the "@" character, but you are saying length is also issue.
- I am running either 2003 or 20H2 on my clients. Are you saying there are additional (new) problems here, or are the problems solved by keeping user name < 15 characters etc?

Thanks!

1. My login to Windows 10 is surename.name@hotmail.com and login to WHS is surename.n (n is the names's first character); when I start to map first network sharing I check 'use other credentials' (it's translated from polish, I'm not sure is it correct translation); When I map next sharing previously used credentials are entered automaticaly (without check 'use others credentials).
2. NetBIOS name is the old format (since deep 90's and Windows 3.1). E-mail format is a LDAP format used since ~2000.
3. Some PCs after upgrade to (or installed as new) 2004 have problems with logon to WHSv1. Probably because of SMBv1 even if SMBv1 is properly configured. It is described here: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/win ... 141a72216f

I hope it is helpful.
Cth.


Last edited by Cthulhu on Sat Mar 27, 2021 4:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2021 4:04 pm 
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rbknox wrote:
rbknox wrote:

Cth, thanks for this reply. Could you clarify further your comments:

- "other credentials (for first sharing, others use them automatically". Not sure I understand this. Please explain.
- "... user name to 15 characters because of NetBIOS limitation". Interesting, so my email is longer than 15 characters - it works, but as I have stated, sometimes it stops working. I will try a shorter login name. I had read somewhere that the issue was with the "@" character, but you are saying length is also issue.
- I am running either 2003 or 20H2 on my clients. Are you saying there are additional (new) problems here, or are the problems solved by keeping user name < 15 characters etc?

Thanks!


Cth, I also looked up NetBIOS limitations. What I found is that computer name is limited to 15 characters. When I looked up user name restrictions I found for Windows 2003 it was 20 characters. Also, didn't see any @ restriction. Strange.


Ooops... It's my fault - NetBIOS username can be 20 characters long. Sorry.

Cth.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 12:04 am 
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So, after about 4 weeks, I finally had my whs share access problem again, with the error message at the top of the thread. This seems to discredit my latest theory that it was a eSata driver issue, and as a result I rolled back the driver to the original (1.2.0.46), since this one allows me the additional SMART functionality. I am currently in week 2 with the old driver, no issues so far. Assuming my intermittent issue is not the eSata driver, I still don't know what causes the problem. Given the problem only seems to happen every 2-4 weeks, I probably need to consider that I have a local network issue -- since in fact my router can cause other problems over a 2-4 week period - wireless problems etc which are resolved with a router reboot. Per lioninstreet post, while I have seen time sync issues in other areas, all my systems seem to be keeping time. The next time it happens, I will check clocks to make sure

Cth posted recently, so wanted to address those comments:

Quote:
1. My login to Windows 10 is surename.name@hotmail.com and login to WHS is surename.n (n is the names's first character); when I start to map first network sharing I check 'use other credentials' (it's translated from polish,

This seems to be a workaround that is essentially the same as what I have been doing. and which is described here: https://superuser.com/questions/509759/ ... icrosoft-a I believe this is really about the "@" character. Microsoft started pushing for account login user names, that being an email address, and that didn't play well with whs v1 because it didn't allow the "@" character in the login name. The workaround is to use credential manager to create an additional login name for use with whs. For those like Ruben who claim they use Microsoft account login but don't use an email address, I'd like to understand that. As I posted earlier, Microsoft seems to insist on either email or phone number (the latter would solve the @ problem). "Hello" approach is a pin, but that I believe is for login screen only ... ??

Quote:
Ooops... It's my fault - NetBIOS username can be 20 characters long. Sorry.

This one is not the issue as in fact NetBios username can be 20 characters. As it happens, mine is exactly 20 characters long, but so long as I remove the "@" it sets up fine.

Quote:
Some PCs after upgrade to (or installed as new) 2004 have problems with logon to WHSv1. Probably because of SMBv1 even if SMBv1 is properly configured. It is described here: https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/win ... 141a72216f

I don't understand everything about smbv1, but I do have to turn on smbv1 in Win apps. Once I do this things seem to work okay. The post Cth references is with regards to the 20H2 update. This doesn't seem to be relevant to the issue I have described. I have some Win 10 clients on the previous (Fall release), and some on 20H2. They all work 99% of the time, until they exhibit the access error after several weeks. I just upgraded my primary workstation to 20H2 - it made no difference to anything. I have a Win 10 server as well on 20H2, and it has exhibited the same intermittent problem of share access.

In summary, I still do not know what is causing this. Seems other whs v1 users out there are either i) disinterested - understandable :) given its age ii) not using W10 as a client iii) experiencing the problem so infrequently that they don't really notice, or iv) are not having the problem. And if the latter folks exist it suggests something unique about my setup, just don't know what.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 12:14 pm 
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I can't recall what I did to not have the email for login.
I believe I initially set up a local login not using a Microsoft account.
Then created a Microsoft account and used it, then set it to use a pin.
So for my pc all I do now is enter a pin to login.

Your local account still exists if you created one prior.
In fact under settings you can switch your windows login back to a local account.
If you did not set one prior maybe there is a option to add a local account.
I do not use my Microsoft account for things such as my NAS or backup utility , just the initial login at the windows prompt.
I always use my local account login for devices that access the pc.

Looking at my Microsoft account I see that my email is set as a alias.
If that means anything and my name is what appears on the account.

I just recently re-installed windows 10 on another pc and since I already had a Microsoft account I used that and it works fine with WHS1.
I never created a local account for it.
And I never used a email account to install win 10 nor the whs1 connector or for login.
Just user name and password.

What I do know is I do have the guest account enabled on my whs1 I always have and have never needed to use the credentials manager

Maybe that has something to do with it.

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 06, 2021 7:34 pm 
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Thanks Ruben,
From the sounds of it, your Microsoft setup is similar to mine. I think the important distinctions though are:
- you are avoiding the email problem by using the guest account. I also enable the guest account but I limit what can be accessed to a few public folders and mostly read only at that. If you fully enable the guest account to access r/w on everything, then you do not need to match your Windows account to the whs user account. But, you give up a lot of user control. I'm assuming that is the way you are using it.
- while you may think your Microsoft account is not tied to your email, I think it is. My account also presents my name, and in fact I can hide the email during login so it looks just like a name login account. However, I don't think you can setup a matching whs account using just your firstname lastname. I disabled my logins on whs, removed the credential manager stuff, and tried creating a whs account as firstname lastname. It did not allow me to access the shared folders that way. So I believe if you want to manage user accounts, say for different family members, you need to use the true account credential which is an email (or maybe a phone number). If you try to enter the email on whs, it will give an error, which is what gave rise to using credential manager. Or you have to create a local account, which for Windows 10 presents other limitations for using One Drive etc.
- You also mentioned using a PIN. Is that the Hello PIN in Windows 10? Again, that obscures your login information, but the PIN is really just another password, and again I don't think you can use it without the email address when trying to match accounts on whs.


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